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Thread: New Player/Population Problems

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    New Player/Population Problems

    Right now if higher level players don't pick novice when there is someone new, then that novice is pretty much useless. They die repeatedly or can't kill anything and they quit, likely for good. High level players don't pick it because it's not fun to play without the talents. The talents are what gives you customization and without it the game is much more dull as you have far fewer build options. Plus the xp usually isn't worth it either.

    The game needs to keep attracting new players and keeping them. So what are some possible solutions?

    There is the dual modes that Xalus implemented for a short time. It forces new players to play with new players, thus they are useful and the game is fun. The only problem is it takes too long for a lobby of 6 new players to fill.

    My suggestion would instead be to raise the xp bonus slightly and instead of restricting talents as a cap you scale dmg, health, potential, etc slightly based on ranks above the cap. This way high level players can still have a wider variety of builds available due to keeping the talent points but still handicaps them so that they don't kill everything and make the new players completely useless. It also makes it more worthwhile for the high level players because they actually get good xp towards rank.

    Also just as a general suggestion. I think that the rank xp curve needs to be lowered a little. Or increase xp gains slightly? Either way I think it takes just a little bit too long to rank up, especially 30+ on.

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    I agree with this as well. It happens all the time.

    The thing is though that often even in the lower modes, higher level players can still obliterate everything even with limited talents. This makes it extremely boring for newbie players, and they learn very little since they really don't have to do anything. On the flip side, the more experienced players are also bored since well, you can just stand there and win for the most part.

    I don't really have a great suggestion to fix this with though.

  3. #3
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    I've been trying to fix this problem for about 3 weeks now, there's really not much I can do anymore. The progression of players inherently splits player groups. The lobby system was actually fine except for the fact that new players were CONSTANTLY joining the 20+ lobby. They didn't know, and there's no way to tell them beforehand really.

    There's really only three solutions to this problem:

    Considerably lower the amount of power Ranks give players

    Somehow separate players based on rank and put them in separate lobbies, which is difficult with bnet

    Make the Novice/Mentor system more restrictive/rewarding, although this option is bad for continuing players.



    Currently I am considering restructuring everything about CHD. I could eliminate a whole bunch of problems the current CHD has, but it would definitely play different than the current CHD.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xalus View Post
    I've been trying to fix this problem for about 3 weeks now, there's really not much I can do anymore. The progression of players inherently splits player groups. The lobby system was actually fine except for the fact that new players were CONSTANTLY joining the 20+ lobby. They didn't know, and there's no way to tell them beforehand really.

    There's really only three solutions to this problem:

    Considerably lower the amount of power Ranks give players

    Somehow separate players based on rank and put them in separate lobbies, which is difficult with bnet

    Make the Novice/Mentor system more restrictive/rewarding, although this option is bad for continuing players.



    Currently I am considering restructuring everything about CHD. I could eliminate a whole bunch of problems the current CHD has, but it would definitely play different than the current CHD.
    You could add the option for a player to automatically be set to rank 20, but gain no experience points. I think that would be good for the casual player and it wouldn't break the game too much. Anyone who really plans on playing for a longer time will be prepared to be weaker while they gain experience.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Xalus View Post
    I've been trying to fix this problem for about 3 weeks now, there's really not much I can do anymore. The progression of players inherently splits player groups. The lobby system was actually fine except for the fact that new players were CONSTANTLY joining the 20+ lobby. They didn't know, and there's no way to tell them beforehand really.
    When you are at the screen where you can either Join or Create a new lobby, that is where it needs to say in big bold letters about the lobby system. Get rid of the picture with tiny text no one reads anyway and replace it one explaining the lobby. That way players see it immediately upon looking at the game for the first time. The text on the side might work as well.

    There's really only three solutions to this problem:

    Considerably lower the amount of power Ranks give players
    That might work. IMO the fun part about this game is the talent system which lets you combine certain talents to form new builds that otherwise aren't doable without enough talent points. Theoretically you could reduce the benefit of ranks while still keeping the variety of build options. The only thing that would suck is... playing for hours to get that 1 rank means less.


    Make the Novice/Mentor system more restrictive/rewarding, although this option is bad for continuing players.
    What about slightly lowering the benefit you get from upgrading things like potential, life, attack dmg, based upon how many ranks above the cap you are? This way you keep talent points and can build, but you aren't as powerful because your attack dmg upgrades don't give as much to you as to the new lvl 0 player. Another way of doing this would be to keep the benefits as they are and simply reduce the amount of minerals high lvl players earn.

    Currently I am considering restructuring everything about CHD. I could eliminate a whole bunch of problems the current CHD has, but it would definitely play different than the current CHD.
    Can you tell us what kind of restructuring you are thinking about doing?

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    I think another issue that deters new players is the inability to unlock certain bonuses. I have tried to bring over 20 friends into the game, but inevitably they see someone playing that has the grandmaster specialist and/or equilibrium skills and when they find out that they missed the period to unlock the hero/skill, inevitably some sort of "well that's lame, let's play something else" type statement pops up. That's how 18/20 of my friends stopped playing. While not a large enough pool to be statistically valid, I think it speaks volumes about what special limited things does to players' joining the game.

    In a type of game where you unlock things by playing more and overcoming new challenges, to be told "you can't unlock this" is a nasty blow to their drive to play more.

    Personally, I can do without, but I do admit I made quite the faces when I heard that you could no longer unlock equilibrium.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Seilen View Post
    I think another issue that deters new players is the inability to unlock certain bonuses. I have tried to bring over 20 friends into the game, but inevitably they see someone playing that has the grandmaster specialist and/or equilibrium skills and when they find out that they missed the period to unlock the hero/skill, inevitably some sort of "well that's lame, let's play something else" type statement pops up. That's how 18/20 of my friends stopped playing. While not a large enough pool to be statistically valid, I think it speaks volumes about what special limited things does to players' joining the game.

    In a type of game where you unlock things by playing more and overcoming new challenges, to be told "you can't unlock this" is a nasty blow to their drive to play more.

    Personally, I can do without, but I do admit I made quite the faces when I heard that you could no longer unlock equilibrium.
    I earned enough to get the Grand Master, but not equilibrium and it does make me a sad panda

    Maybe mentor points can be used as a currency to buy stuff like GM, Equilibrium, and other things. That would also encourage playing with novices and teaching them the ropes.

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    You can still get everything except GM marine. I recycle event rewards, so they will come up again. I have just been very busy lately and haven't been able to run an event.


    I guess I should be more clear on that.


    As for the restructuring, the major changes would be no more exponential scaling, everything would scale linearly, and Talents would be roughly halved in power.

    The end result would be players and enemies wouldn't get ridiculously powerful as the game progresses, there would still be a substantial power increase though. Specialized builds would be the result of Talent building instead of upgrades for the most part. Also the power of ranks would be toned back considerably with these changes.

    The only reason things actually scale exponentially is because when I started using SC2 editor I couldn't find a way to make certain things work the way I wanted, now I have the knowledge how to work around the editor's problems.
    Last edited by Xalus; 11-17-2013 at 10:26 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The_Animus View Post
    I earned enough to get the Grand Master, but not equilibrium and it does make me a sad panda

    Maybe mentor points can be used as a currency to buy stuff like GM, Equilibrium, and other things. That would also encourage playing with novices and teaching them the ropes.
    Is there any way you can tell when there's an event on and how many "points" you've earned?

    Quote Originally Posted by Xalus View Post
    You can still get everything except GM marine. I recycle event rewards, so they will come up again. I have just been very busy lately and haven't been able to run an event.
    I guess I should be more clear on that.
    This is definitely good to hear. Would you be able to elaborate more on how events function? I'm pretty clueless about that and nobody has really been able to explain it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Xalus View Post
    As for the restructuring, the major changes would be no more exponential scaling, everything would scale linearly, and Talents would be roughly halved in power.
    I think linear scaling would make much more sense in terms of understanding where you actually sit in the power scale. That would simplify a lot of things which I think would be great. I personally would rather each level get progressively harder at a steady rate rather than being fine one level and getting absolutely obliterated the next because you chose to upgrade a skill rather than get that extra 15 potential that would actually make a massive difference in DPS.
    Last edited by Seilen; 11-18-2013 at 10:55 PM.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seilen View Post
    Is there any way you can tell when there's an event on and how many "points" you've earned?



    This is definitely good to hear. Would you be able to elaborate more on how events function? I'm pretty clueless about that and nobody has really been able to explain it.
    I noticed it in the patch notes. One day when reading the latest patch it mentioned an event and the time period and the potential rewards. The "event" wasn't actually anything. It's just a weekend or something where if you win you also get a certain number of event points. At the end Xalus adds another patch that gives the appropriate prizes to those who earned them.

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